Saint posted:

@Enthusiastic Contrafibularities time will tell i suppose

 

I'm disappointed they have chosen not to be part of a very important tradition.

Effectively turning their back on the UK - why should anyone else feel proud to be British if a Royal will walk away?

And why support the Monarchy if they won't support each other?

It's a mess

The thing is, however, that the Royal Family isn't just the monarchy of the UK: it represents the monarchy of fifteen other countries as well - and that includes Canada...

Look at it in a global, "Commonwealth realms" context: Harry is only 5th in line to the throne (at the moment...), so his absence isn't going to be a huge loss to the UK monarchy. The Canadian monarchy, however, is stable and long-established, and yet - AFAIK - has never had a resident Royal. Think of the boost it would get from having Harry and Meghan move there...

 

[Fun Fact: the Canadian monarchy is not only one of the oldest continuing monarchies in the world; it's actually run continuously for longer than the UK monarchy.

(The series of French Kings who ruled over their "Colony of Canada" overlaps the Cromwell era...)]

My two cents worth ( because I can’t sleep!)

royalty is a way of life, you are born into it and yes it can be a burden ( think of the queens father). If you marry into it you become “one of them” and you toe the party line,  there is no room for divas or the male equivalent, you are to an extent faceless or “one person “ the monarchy is one and always united,  change has to be gradual 

Whether it's the 'future'

Or their 'right'

Or has public sympathy

It's the attitude towards duty and honouring a historic role. 

To me it's akin to a captain abandoning ship cos he's fed up being a captain.

 

I wonder if they will be carrying out any Royal duties?

If not then to me it's an abdication and a betrayal of his position, family and the country

machel posted:

My two cents worth ( because I can’t sleep!)

royalty is a way of life, you are born into it and yes it can be a burden ( think of the queens father). If you marry into it you become “one of them” and you toe the party line,  there is no room for divas or the male equivalent, you are to an extent faceless or “one person “ the monarchy is one and always united,  change has to be gradual 

Saint posted:

Whether it's the 'future'

Or their 'right'

Or has public sympathy

It's the attitude towards duty and honouring a historic role. 

To me it's akin to a captain abandoning ship cos he's fed up being a captain.

 

I wonder if they will be carrying out any Royal duties?

If not then to me it's an abdication and a betrayal of his position, family and the country

I agree with both of you 

Saint posted:

Whether it's the 'future'

Or their 'right'

Or has public sympathy

It's the attitude towards duty and honouring a historic role. 

To me it's akin to a captain abandoning ship cos he's fed up being a captain.

 

I wonder if they will be carrying out any Royal duties?

If not then to me it's an abdication and a betrayal of his position, family and the country

Or they are not the captain and wife but an officer moving away from the top table and don’t like it

machel posted:
Saint posted:

Whether it's the 'future'

Or their 'right'

Or has public sympathy

It's the attitude towards duty and honouring a historic role. 

To me it's akin to a captain abandoning ship cos he's fed up being a captain.

 

I wonder if they will be carrying out any Royal duties?

If not then to me it's an abdication and a betrayal of his position, family and the country

Or they are not the captain and wife but an officer moving away from the top table and don’t like it

Oh it's pecking order for sure

Can I just say how much I loathe Piers Morgan? Shut up you arrogant, divisive toad!

I still feel that Prince Andrew is far worse news for the royal family than the Sussexes. He must be so happy the narrative has shifted from him so quickly. Media sure are feeding the reaction to these two. From a distance, I am finding it hard to decide exactly what is going on through all the bullc**p being thrown around by the press and their so called “palace insider” exclusives..

Excuse my tone, my husband has been in intensive care for the last few days and I am a bit punchy. 

Roxan posted:

Can I just say how much I loathe Piers Morgan? Shut up you arrogant, divisive toad!

I still feel that Prince Andrew is far worse news for the royal family than the Sussexes. He must be so happy the narrative has shifted from him so quickly. Media sure are feeding the reaction to these two. From a distance, I am finding it hard to decide exactly what is going on through all the bullc**p being thrown around by the press and their so called “palace insider” exclusives..

Excuse my tone, my husband has been in intensive care for the last few days and I am a bit punchy. 

Omg Roxan ....is he ok ?

Hi sorry shouldn’t have gone off topic here. He is improving, something blocking blood flow to intestines. He has been nil by mouth to get the swelling down so they can do an endoscopy because they don’t know what is causing it. 

Roxan posted:

Hi sorry shouldn’t have gone off topic here. He is improving, something blocking blood flow to intestines. He has been nil by mouth to get the swelling down so they can do an endoscopy because they don’t know what is causing it. 

Awww Roxan ....I hope they can sort it out quickly ...you must be so worried ....and no apology needed 

Roxan posted:

Hi sorry shouldn’t have gone off topic here. He is improving, something blocking blood flow to intestines. He has been nil by mouth to get the swelling down so they can do an endoscopy because they don’t know what is causing it. 

Hopefully, the endoscopy will show what is causing the blockage and they can sort it out for him 

Saint posted:

@Roxan my Mum was in Critical care for several days with a perforated intestine and a further 3 months before her operation.

It's a terrifying time but luckily she made a full recovery

Please go off topic all you like - take care x 

Thanks Renton appreciate the words

Roxan posted:

So from here, through filtered press reports, it seems like people are far more bothered by the Sussexes decision than by Prince Andrew. Is that true do you think?

Hi Roxan How is your husband doing ? 

Although the Sussex’s seem to have caused more consternation at the moment , I think both have probably been given equal news space 

I think the Prince Andrew mess has been utterly swept under the carpet by the Royals and as it's probably in some sort of legal process the press are being careful what they say.

The Royals want Andrew to fade into the background.

I wonder if Harry's announcement was strategically planned? 

Saint posted:

I think the Prince Andrew mess has been utterly swept under the carpet by the Royals and as it's probably in some sort of legal process the press are being careful what they say.

The Royals want Andrew to fade into the background.

I wonder if Harry's announcement was strategically planned

The cynic in me wondered that too Renton 

Baz posted:
Saint posted:

I think the Prince Andrew mess has been utterly swept under the carpet by the Royals and as it's probably in some sort of legal process the press are being careful what they say.

The Royals want Andrew to fade into the background.

I wonder if Harry's announcement was strategically planned

The cynic in me wondered that too Renton 

Me three!

The FBI have no plans to call him to testify, major strings being pulled on the diplomatic front I feel...

 

Roxan posted:
Baz posted:
Saint posted:

I think the Prince Andrew mess has been utterly swept under the carpet by the Royals and as it's probably in some sort of legal process the press are being careful what they say.

The Royals want Andrew to fade into the background.

I wonder if Harry's announcement was strategically planned

The cynic in me wondered that too Renton 

Me three!

The FBI have no plans to call him to testify, major strings being pulled on the diplomatic front I feel...

 

Playing devil’s advocate to a certain extent, it is possible there is no evidence against him, hence no plans to call him to testify.

I’m not a fan of Prince Andrew but he does seem to have been tried and convicted in the court of public opinion/media, on the basis of a single photograph and an unsubstantiated accusation. He hasn’t been convicted or even charged with anything. 

Baz posted:
Roxan posted:
Baz posted:
Saint posted:

I think the Prince Andrew mess has been utterly swept under the carpet by the Royals and as it's probably in some sort of legal process the press are being careful what they say.

The Royals want Andrew to fade into the background.

I wonder if Harry's announcement was strategically planned

The cynic in me wondered that too Renton 

Me three!

The FBI have no plans to call him to testify, major strings being pulled on the diplomatic front I feel...

 

 

I read that as the fbi weren’t calling Roxan 

Yogi19 posted:
Roxan posted:
Baz posted:
Saint posted:

I think the Prince Andrew mess has been utterly swept under the carpet by the Royals and as it's probably in some sort of legal process the press are being careful what they say.

The Royals want Andrew to fade into the background.

I wonder if Harry's announcement was strategically planned

The cynic in me wondered that too Renton 

Me three!

The FBI have no plans to call him to testify, major strings being pulled on the diplomatic front I feel...

 

Playing devil’s advocate to a certain extent, it is possible there is no evidence against him, hence no plans to call him to testify.

I’m not a fan of Prince Andrew but he does seem to have been tried and convicted in the court of public opinion/media, on the basis of a single photograph and an unsubstantiated accusation. He hasn’t been convicted or even charged with anything. 

I said to testify, as a witness. Several of the victims named him as having information about Maxwell and Epstein but the FBI won’t pursue it.

Baz posted:
Baz posted:
Roxan posted:
Baz posted:
Saint posted:

I think the Prince Andrew mess has been utterly swept under the carpet by the Royals and as it's probably in some sort of legal process the press are being careful what they say.

The Royals want Andrew to fade into the background.

I wonder if Harry's announcement was strategically planned

The cynic in me wondered that too Renton 

Me three!

The FBI have no plans to call him to testify, major strings being pulled on the diplomatic front I feel...

 

 

I read that as the fbi weren’t calling Roxan 

Roxan posted:
Yogi19 posted:
Roxan posted:
Baz posted:
Saint posted:

I think the Prince Andrew mess has been utterly swept under the carpet by the Royals and as it's probably in some sort of legal process the press are being careful what they say.

The Royals want Andrew to fade into the background.

I wonder if Harry's announcement was strategically planned

The cynic in me wondered that too Renton 

Me three!

The FBI have no plans to call him to testify, major strings being pulled on the diplomatic front I feel...

 

Playing devil’s advocate to a certain extent, it is possible there is no evidence against him, hence no plans to call him to testify.

I’m not a fan of Prince Andrew but he does seem to have been tried and convicted in the court of public opinion/media, on the basis of a single photograph and an unsubstantiated accusation. He hasn’t been convicted or even charged with anything. 

I said to testify, as a witness. Several of the victims named him as having information about Maxwell and Epstein but the FBI won’t pursue it.

Sorry, I misread your post. 

Saint posted:

Eamonn Holmes has no sympathy for Meghan Markle:

"I just find her incredibly irritating. I've never met her but I look at her and I think 'I don't think I'd like you in real life.' Awful, woke, weak, manipulative, spoilt..."

 

I thought better of him - he's an idiot if he bases his condemning opinion on a 'feeling'.

He's a journalist FGS but brings forward no evidence. It's just nasty not professional.

It only adds weight to their justification to quit and move abroad.

I do agree with you Saint. However, we all do it, just not in such a public way. 

 

What did make me laugh was the clip allegedly showing Harry touting his missuses voice-over credentails to the head of Disney. If it's true, it's a super-cringeworthy-sad thing to do.

Saint posted:

@Enthusiastic Contrafibularities time will tell i suppose

 

I'm disappointed they have chosen not to be part of a very important tradition.

Effectively turning their back on the UK - why should anyone else feel proud to be British if a Royal will walk away?

And why support the Monarchy if they won't support each other?

It's a mess

I guess, some of those who are not Royalists may be proud to be British (we would need to ask them). Personally, the Royals are not the epicentre of Britishness for me.

Enthusiastic Contrafibularities posted:
Saint posted:

Eamonn Holmes has no sympathy for Meghan Markle:

"I just find her incredibly irritating. I've never met her but I look at her and I think 'I don't think I'd like you in real life.' Awful, woke, weak, manipulative, spoilt..."

 

I thought better of him - he's an idiot if he bases his condemning opinion on a 'feeling'.

He's a journalist FGS but brings forward no evidence. It's just nasty not professional.

It only adds weight to their justification to quit and move abroad.

I do agree with you Saint. However, we all do it, just not in such a public way. 

 

What did make me laugh was the clip allegedly showing Harry touting his missuses voice-over credentails to the head of Disney. If it's true, it's a super-cringeworthy-sad thing to do.

Nothing would surprise me EC I am sure I read somewhere they’ve already considered going on Oprah 

Enthusiastic Contrafibularities posted:
Saint posted:

Eamonn Holmes has no sympathy for Meghan Markle:

"I just find her incredibly irritating. I've never met her but I look at her and I think 'I don't think I'd like you in real life.' Awful, woke, weak, manipulative, spoilt..."

 

I thought better of him - he's an idiot if he bases his condemning opinion on a 'feeling'.

He's a journalist FGS but brings forward no evidence. It's just nasty not professional.

It only adds weight to their justification to quit and move abroad.

I do agree with you Saint. However, we all do it, just not in such a public way

 

What did make me laugh was the clip allegedly showing Harry touting his missuses voice-over credentails to the head of Disney. If it's true, it's a super-cringeworthy-sad thing to do.

He's a journalist, broadcasting on a radio station.

All he was doing was spouting unhelpful spite towards a person he doesn't know and has never met.

It's unprofessional and childish.

He needs to grow up  ... and that's something coming from me 

Saint posted:
Enthusiastic Contrafibularities posted:
Saint posted:

Eamonn Holmes has no sympathy for Meghan Markle:

"I just find her incredibly irritating. I've never met her but I look at her and I think 'I don't think I'd like you in real life.' Awful, woke, weak, manipulative, spoilt..."

 

I thought better of him - he's an idiot if he bases his condemning opinion on a 'feeling'.

He's a journalist FGS but brings forward no evidence. It's just nasty not professional.

It only adds weight to their justification to quit and move abroad.

I do agree with you Saint. However, we all do it, just not in such a public way

 

What did make me laugh was the clip allegedly showing Harry touting his missuses voice-over credentails to the head of Disney. If it's true, it's a super-cringeworthy-sad thing to do.

He's a journalist, broadcasting on a radio station.

All he was doing was spouting unhelpful spite towards a person he doesn't know and has never met.

It's unprofessional and childish.

He needs to grow up  ... and that's something coming from me 

 

Good luck to them and I can't blame them at all for sticking two fingers up to our vile and racist right-wing press.

 

The press need them to fill their useless rags with royal gossip and to use their archive photos in their crappy souvenir editions.  Harry and Meghan have got sick of the press's split personality between fawning sycophancy when it suits and snide attacks when it suits - mostly at Meghan's expense.  Harry is doing right by his wife rather than throwing her under the bus to the delight of tabloid editors. They aren't playing ball - good luck to them.

Carny - the Sussex's are just as much cannon fodder if they choose to pursue a celebrity lifestyle elsewhere.

They could have chosen to live out a quieter life, do the Royal things they do in a subdued manner and leave it at that.

If all you get is a thank you and a no comment then the stories will fizzle out.

 

By doing what they've done, it's counter productive - it's increasing scrutiny and stories.

Is racism the real reason OR used as a reason to go elsewhere and live by their rules.

 

I honestly think that is the truth. They're bored of what being a Royal means and want freedom to do as they please.

It's an abdication by the back door.

Enthusiastic Contrafibularities posted:
Saint posted:

@Enthusiastic Contrafibularities time will tell i suppose

 

I'm disappointed they have chosen not to be part of a very important tradition.

Effectively turning their back on the UK - why should anyone else feel proud to be British if a Royal will walk away?

And why support the Monarchy if they won't support each other?

It's a mess

I guess, some of those who are not Royalists may be proud to be British (we would need to ask them). Personally, the Royals are not the epicentre of Britishness for me.

I'm not a royalist, I don't agree with the institution on ethical grounds that it is a throwback to feudalism. I don't agree with the so-called "church of England" deferring to a monarch either. 

 

There are lots of reasons to be proud of this country but I expect mine don't generally match the general ideas of patriotism of most.  There are lots of reasons to be ashamed of being British too.  In my mind, royalty plays a very small part in both those feelings.

Saint posted:

Carny - the Sussex's are just as much cannon fodder if they choose to pursue a celebrity lifestyle elsewhere.

They could have chosen to live out a quieter life, do the Royal things they do in a subdued manner and leave it at that.

If all you get is a thank you and a no comment then the stories will fizzle out.

 

By doing what they've done, it's counter productive - it's increasing scrutiny and stories.

Is racism the real reason OR used as a reason to go elsewhere and live by their rules.

 

I honestly think that is the truth. They're bored of what being a Royal means and want freedom to do as they please.

It's an abdication by the back door.

The racism is definately there and press pander to it, as they always have.  

 

I tend to agree, they probably are bored with it.  After all, he's not going to be king!  Charles is what?  70 by now?  The queen won't abdicate because she's full of her own self-importance and loves the sycophancy.  We don't live in the middle ages, the country isn't going sink into the sea if she abdicates.

 

I always thought Meghan gave up a lot to be in the royal gilded cage.  Being independently wealthy and living a good showbiz life.  Swapping a more meritocratic branch of celebrity with freedoms for one of no meritocracy but plenty of institutional straight jackets. 

 

I don't blame them for wanting out, they don't need the hassle and one half doesn't deserve the constant snipes and judgement by tabloid hypocrites.  The media want a demure, Laura Ashley royal baby-making English rose archetype.  Meghan's her own woman and is not having that - and they hate her for it.  

Do you not think Harry should have had a ruddy good chat to her and said 'exactly' what being in the Royal family means.

If not he should have - she should have known exactly what was going to happen (I don't agree with the press either) and exactly what her role would entail.

It's the very least he should have done, no?

 

Is it really going to be any different in Canada - the UK press can see Canada y'know.

I think it's wanting freedom NOT wanting privacy. And with the freedom comes all the same publicity

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