Carnelian posted:Baz posted:Carnelian posted:Baz posted:A very wise man ( my dad
) said that once you resort to hate, and name calling, you have already lost the argument ! What the country needs is for our politicians (and their supporters )to stop with the fanatical rhetoric and start looking for ways to talk to each other! Until that happens ....be they far right , or pseudo socialists ....this country will continue to go down the pan.....and the losers will be the very people that need it most !
It would be nice in a perfect world but our Tory politicians are hateful and heartless. Thousands have died directly due to cruel sanctioning and being made homeless. This government has blood on their hands.
It would be nice to think the Tories could magically become decent and compassionate but it's not in their DNA. May's warm words about a prosperous country for all are just cynical politicking.
Baz, sorry, I know you mean the best and respect you for that and your faith in human nature but they deserve my hatred in the same way a wife beater deserves my hatred. They have presided over gratuitous cruelty to the most disadvantaged and their policies have caused unnecessary deaths and harm.
George Osborne is on record as saying that cuts to disability benefits played well with core Tory voters. It's not just that party, it's their support base too.
Trust me Carnelian , I have very little faith in human nature ....especially when it comes to politicians
The difference between us is that I tar them all with the same brush , and I’m sorry , but I don’t believe Labour, as it stands now , would be any different ....and like Moonie , I certainly wouldn’t trust Corbyn ....and Momentum even less ! But in fact I doubt he would even want to be in charge right now , cos let’s face it , Brexit is a total poisoned chalice . The sad thing is that should there be an election any time soon , for the first time in 5 decades I really can’t think who I’d vote for .
I'm a member of Momentum. After initial reservations I joined Momentum and they are not the demons they have been painted as by the media. I can tell you I would not join a bully-boy organisation. Of course there are hotheads who shame the organisation but the values of Momentum are to promote Corbyn, to repel a establishment big biz approved Blairite kickback and promote a democratic socialist alternative to the failed policies of Thatcherism and Thatcherism lite that delivered the Iraq war, the banking crisis, zero hours, housing crisis, knife crime crisis, 10 years of wage stagnation and employed Atos to hound the critically ill to their deaths.
Momentum are democratic and totally opposed to antisemitism among all other forms of racism.
You say you don't trust Momentum but how much first hand knowledge do you really know about Momentum people and the values they hold?
I’ve said it before , but I’ll say it again , I tend not to believe the media ....of any shade ...any more than I believe politicians I am probably more aware than most of the various biases . What I do do is try to listen to parliamentary debates.....and points of view ....then make up my own mind .. But, when I see people of any faction ....right or left ..... spewing bile and hatred I lose all faith in their argument ....no matter how cogent that argument may appear on the surface .
Like Moonie , I used to vote Labour at one point in time , but .....as with the Conservatives .....someone in the party seems to have pushed the self destruct button recently ....and when seemingly decent people no longer feel able to remain within the party I suggest that maybe there needs to be a serious rethink . Constitutionally the country is in a horrendous mess ....and what we need...and don’t have ..... is an efficient executive , but equally we need a credible opposition! Instead of this we have one faction of the party bent on blind hero worship , and another faction bent on thwarting it .....and all the while the country is going to Hell in a handcart ! Moreover , it’s not a nicety to recognise that hate and negativity won’t solve our problems , it will just make the solutions less likely .