it looks good to me-and its all costed
and
ive been enjoying laura kuenssberg doing her twisty spiteful face on every news bulletin
she reminds me of Gerry McCann
he's always got a pinched twisty spiteful face & a whiny voice
apart from that
corbyn seems quite strong & stable
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If I can find this man I'm gonna buy him as many drinks as he want, Laura the Tory is getting an hammering on twitter about LP's costings when she's never once questioned the Tories on borrowing more in five years than all the Labour governments put together 
Meanwhile the Tories have put publishing theirs off again, so far we have...
Maybe VAT and NI rises.
No triple lock on pensions.
Not ruled out more cuts to the disabled.
One year off work to care for ill relatives...unpaid 
and murder foxes 
I hate the Tories with a passion.Cannot stick that mare May.I have a serps pension .I now live alone in a two bed house,a luxury that must be taxed according to the Tory bastards.The fooking bedroom tax.Fortunately I get the discretionary payment to make up the difference (one good thing about the SNP).I Will always vote labour.
Dame Ann
ive been reading a hell of a lot of corbyn supported the IRA
but
have you noticed that the last time MSM came out with that crap was 2015?
if it was really true the daily mail would be all over it like a rash & wouldnt stop banging on about it
yet
the MSM arent
is it because, in spite of all those pics & news reports from 20+ yrs ago the MSM twisted it around to make him look like a terrorist supporter but he wasnt?
he was trying to achieve peace
now you might say BUT LOOK THE EVIDENCE IS THERE IN PICTURES & STATEMENTS
but was it?
because believe me the media would NOW be on it like a pack of hounds chasing a fox-yet theyre not
have a think about it
He did talk to the IRA Pirate to try and pave the way for peace talks, he did it in the open. Thatcher did it in secret, Willie Whitelaw was flying the IRA into London for meetings in the 70's and Blair had talks with them, at the end of the day it was talks that secured the peace agreement.
He won the Gandhi peace prize in 2013 for his lifelong work in trying to negotiate peace. They are dragging things up form 30 years ago because he can't be bought....
We deal with the Saudi's, we sell them arms and it never gets mentioned by the right wing media..the labour party said they would stop the sale of arms to Saudi
The worrying thing for me is that I work with far too many younger voters who are disinterested and will not be voting.
So true EC my niece is 30 this year,and had voted once in her life,(local and national elections).I rage at her but she "can't be arsed".sigh.
kattymieoww posted:So true EC my niece is 30 this year,and had voted once in her life,(local and national elections).I rage at her but she "can't be arsed".sigh.
The response I hear is "I'm just not interested".
*sighs*
There was an election just a few months after I turned 18, I voted in it and have voted in every election since. In that first election I voted the same as my parents as I didn't really know anything much about the political scene at that time, but it wasn't long before I felt I knew enough to decide for myself and if I was now voting the same as my parents (and I know there were at least TWO occasions where I didn't) it was purely co-incidental. 
Question ....what is going to happen to all those now employed in the private sectors when they get nationlised ? Will they all be employed , or is there going to be some * rationalisation * too ? And will they be paid the same ....or take a pay cut ? And if it's the former how are they going to find the money to make improvements?
Baz posted:Question ....what is going to happen to all those now employed in the private sectors when they get nationlised ? Will they all be employed , or is there going to be some * rationalisation * too ? And will they be paid the same ....or take a pay cut ? And if it's the former how are they going to find the money to make improvements?
I'm assuming they would keep their jobs, I can't remember people losing jobs when we had to take over the East Coast line in 2009. The line was making massive profit up until 2015 and the tories sold it off again... I think customer satisfaction was in the 80% 's.
We are already pumping huge amounts of cash (ÂĢ5Bn) each year into the so called private networks.
That 5Bn would become investment in OUR railway and the profits currently taken by private interests, currently 74% of whom are foreign nationalised railways, would become profit back into the nation. Or forgone and given back to users in cheaper fares.
http://www.independent.co.uk/n...xpayers-8866157.html
Baz posted:Question ....what is going to happen to all those now employed in the private sectors when they get nationlised ? Will they all be employed , or is there going to be some * rationalisation * too ? And will they be paid the same ....or take a pay cut ? And if it's the former how are they going to find the money to make improvements?
I'm going to start to say ...
Comment - and then say something
A bit like Question and then asking a question (like wot Baz has done - twit)
Saint posted:Baz posted:Question ....what is going to happen to all those now employed in the private sectors when they get nationlised ? Will they all be employed , or is there going to be some * rationalisation * too ? And will they be paid the same ....or take a pay cut ? And if it's the former how are they going to find the money to make improvements?
I'm going to start to say ...
Comment - and then say something
A bit like Question and then asking a question (like wot Baz has done - twit)
Baz posted:I know the East coast was profitable ...I just hope it all works out the way you think it will Dame .....but tbh my memory of the nationalised industries isn't quite that rosy
I know one thing Baz, we are better putting it into this country than profits going abroad and their railways are cheaper better and pension much higher due to profits made in this country, Private companies will always, always put profit before anything else.
Dame_Ann_Average posted:Baz posted:I know the East coast was profitable ...I just hope it all works out the way you think it will Dame .....but tbh my memory of the nationalised industries isn't quite that rosy
I know one thing Baz, we are better putting it into this country than profits going abroad and their railways are cheaper better and pension much higher due to profits made in this country, Private companies will always, always put profit before anything else.
Probably Dame ....but I for one don't fancy being at the mercy of the unions again , been there , done that , lived through the 70s
Comment - if private companies can run it at a profit then surely the Gov can.
Saint posted:Comment - if private companies can run it at a profit then surely the Gov can.
a massive profit Renton and it's not going back into the railways, it's going abroad to maintain their railways, to the shareholders and to pension pots not in this country 
Plus, on top of the profits they are making we are also giving the massive subsidies
Baz posted:Probably Dame ....but I for one don't fancy being at the mercy of the unions again , been there , done that , lived through the 70s
Baz, now people have to work on zero hour contracts and can be told on the day we have no work, we have two hours work. Unions gave us a lot of rights, we have none at all now and the unions have little power. I don't want the people of this country to be trying to survive on nothing and that's what's happening now....I hate the tories and will to my dying day.
The bedroom tax as Katty said she's lucky enough to get some help, many thousands on 50's woman in England that were given no warning that their pension age was going up can't afford to live and don't get help with the bedroom tax. I luckily don't have that problem...but to starve people because in Katty's words they have the luxury of having one spare room is nothing. I remember the 70's and I could easily go back to then rather than now.
Dame_Ann_Average posted:Baz posted:Probably Dame ....but I for one don't fancy being at the mercy of the unions again , been there , done that , lived through the 70s
Baz, now people have to work on zero hour contracts and can be told on the day we have no work, we have two hours work. Unions gave us a lot of rights, we have none at all now and the unions have little power. I don't want the people of this country to be trying to survive on nothing and that's what's happening now....I hate the tories and will to my dying day.
The bedroom tax as Katty said she's lucky enough to get some help, many thousands on 50's woman in England that were given no warning that their pension age was going up can't afford to live and don't get help with the bedroom tax. I luckily don't have that problem...but to starve people because in Katty's words they have the luxury of having one spare room is nothing. I remember the 70's and I could easily go back to then rather than now.
We wil have to agree to differ on that , but time will tell ..one way or another
Baz posted:
I think on this subject we always will Baz
Dame_Ann_Average posted:Baz posted:Probably Dame ....but I for one don't fancy being at the mercy of the unions again , been there , done that , lived through the 70s
Baz, now people have to work on zero hour contracts and can be told on the day we have no work, we have two hours work. Unions gave us a lot of rights, we have none at all now and the unions have little power. I don't want the people of this country to be trying to survive on nothing and that's what's happening now....I hate the tories and will to my dying day.
The bedroom tax as Katty said she's lucky enough to get some help, many thousands on 50's woman in England that were given no warning that their pension age was going up can't afford to live and don't get help with the bedroom tax. I luckily don't have that problem...but to starve people because in Katty's words they have the luxury of having one spare room is nothing. I remember the 70's and I could easily go back to then rather than now.
Although I was younger than some peeps in the 70's (And I don't mean anything by that) I obviously don't remember as much but it certainly seemed like better times that I do remember
Sprout posted:
I can't remember kids going to school hungry Pam, nurses not being able to afford to train...the 11 plus and the working class afforded the same opportunity to go to university as the middle class...better and happier times by far.
Sprout posted:Dame_Ann_Average posted:Baz posted:Probably Dame ....but I for one don't fancy being at the mercy of the unions again , been there , done that , lived through the 70s
Baz, now people have to work on zero hour contracts and can be told on the day we have no work, we have two hours work. Unions gave us a lot of rights, we have none at all now and the unions have little power. I don't want the people of this country to be trying to survive on nothing and that's what's happening now....I hate the tories and will to my dying day.
The bedroom tax as Katty said she's lucky enough to get some help, many thousands on 50's woman in England that were given no warning that their pension age was going up can't afford to live and don't get help with the bedroom tax. I luckily don't have that problem...but to starve people because in Katty's words they have the luxury of having one spare room is nothing. I remember the 70's and I could easily go back to then rather than now.
I was in my teens and I remember strikes and the winter of discontent.
Dame_Ann_Average posted:Sprout posted:
I can't remember kids going to school hungry Pam, nurses not being able to afford to train...the 11 plus and the working class afforded the same opportunity to go to university as the middle class...better and happier times by far.
Ted Heath having ink thrown over him
Kinnock falling in the sea
Michael Foot attending Remembrance Day in a donkey jacket duffle coat
I can't remember any of them 
I was the last year that did the 11+ and I consider myself lucky for that. My elder sister and I both went to the senior secondary, which was widely accredited as having superior teaching staff. My younger sister would have gone to (what had been) the junior secondary, which was still considered to be a bit inferior, but we had had to move house as my grandmother was coming to live with us and the new house (whether by luck or design) happened to be in the catchment area for the (senior) secondary
Yogi19 posted:Sprout posted:Dame_Ann_Average posted:Baz posted:Probably Dame ....but I for one don't fancy being at the mercy of the unions again , been there , done that , lived through the 70s
Baz, now people have to work on zero hour contracts and can be told on the day we have no work, we have two hours work. Unions gave us a lot of rights, we have none at all now and the unions have little power. I don't want the people of this country to be trying to survive on nothing and that's what's happening now....I hate the tories and will to my dying day.
The bedroom tax as Katty said she's lucky enough to get some help, many thousands on 50's woman in England that were given no warning that their pension age was going up can't afford to live and don't get help with the bedroom tax. I luckily don't have that problem...but to starve people because in Katty's words they have the luxury of having one spare room is nothing. I remember the 70's and I could easily go back to then rather than now.
I was in my teens and I remember strikes and the winter of discontent.
I was in my 20s in the 1970s ....and was actually working for a nationalised electric company during some of the worst of it .....the unions went strike/power mad!! There were scheduled.... and unscheduled power outages lasting hours... hospitals had function to on batteries and candles .....people were forced to take clean bedding and food into their relatives in hospitals .....rubbish piled up in the streets .....there were three/four day weeks etc.etc. I NEVER want to go through that again! It certainly coloured my political views .....from then on in I stopped voting Labour and voted Liberal .....until recently ....
Enthusiastic Contrafibularities posted:
The worrying thing for me is that I work with far too many younger voters who are disinterested and will not be voting.
this is very very sweary but very very true..show your kids..it might just make them vote!
The seventies had a myriad of problems, the miners were striking for a for a pay rise plus the arab states launched attacks on Israel causing oil prices to soar, post offices issued petrol coupons and we had to have a three day working week...Ted Heath was then the Conservative Prime Minister. In the late 70's we had the Winter of discontent when the the then Labour Prime Minister Jim Callaghan tried to cap wages to try and control inflation...much like what the tories have done for seven years, capped wages to the poorest while the top 5% have had tax breaks and wage increases.
I would much rather put up with a few weeks of inconvenience than watch people being made homeless through the bedroom tax, watch people with learning difficulties not being able to understand bus timetables and being late for Jobseekers appointments and being sanctioned for weeks on end without a penny to live on. Watch someone suffering with diabetes not being able to eat properly or afford electricity to store insulin .Or watch someone who worked all their lives, paid their NI be struck down with Dementia or Alzheimer's and the only asset they own and have worked for to be taken away they can leave to their children...their family home. Or watch pensioners not being able to heat their homes through winter. Not that any of that would happen now because the Unions have no power, I'm suprised instead of strikes there's not anarchy on the streets.
I certainly know I would prefer a few weeks of that compared to the seven years we have had and worse to come. Just my opinion on how I see things
Dame_Ann_Average posted:
The seventies had a myriad of problems, the miners were striking for a for a pay rise plus the arab states launched attacks on Israel causing oil prices to soar, post offices issued petrol coupons and we had to have a three day working week...Ted Heath was then the Conservative Prime Minister. In the late 70's we had the Winter of discontent when the the then Labour Prime Minister Jim Callaghan tried to cap wages to try and control inflation...much like what the tories have done for seven years, capped wages to the poorest while the top 5% have had tax breaks and wage increases.
I would much rather put up with a few weeks of inconvenience than watch people being made homeless through the bedroom tax, watch people with learning difficulties not being able to understand bus timetables and being late for Jobseekers appointments and being sanctioned for weeks on end without a penny to live on. Watch someone suffering with diabetes not being able to eat properly or afford electricity to store insulin .Or watch someone who worked all their lives, paid their NI be struck down with Dementia or Alzheimer's and the only asset they own and have worked for to be taken away they can leave to their children...their family home. Or watch pensioners not being able to heat their homes through winter. Not that any of that would happen now because the Unions have no power, I'm suprised instead of strikes there's not anarchy on the streets.
I certainly know I would prefer a few weeks of that compared to the seven years we have had and worse to come. Just my opinion on how I see things
I know we aren't going to agree ....I just wanted to point out that things were not rosy in the 70s .....or at any other time......think 69s Cathy Come Home for homelessness .......and yes, I would like to think that the house I've worked all my life for wasn't going to be swallowed up paying for our care costs .....but on the other hand I guess there is an argument for saying why shouldn't I expect it for free if I have the assets .
I'm sorry I just don't believe Labours * we are going to do everything * promise ...in fact I think you are going to be very disappointed when /if they get into power. Promising the earth is easy in opposition , but it never translates into reality once any party....and I do mean any party ...gets into power . But time will tell
I think whatever they achieve will be make lives better for some Baz and care is not free, we pay NI all our lives and some don't even reach retirement. You're right though, we'll never agree on this 
Baz posted:Oh and it wasn't a few weeks in the 70s ...it started in 1970 and went through the whole decade in one form or another....that's why we ended up with over a decade of bliddy Thatcher....
I did explain that Baz... Ted Heath was in power in the first half of the seventies ..it was 1973 and again in 78/79.
Baz posted:Dame_Ann_Average posted:
The seventies had a myriad of problems, the miners were striking for a for a pay rise plus the arab states launched attacks on Israel causing oil prices to soar, post offices issued petrol coupons and we had to have a three day working week...Ted Heath was then the Conservative Prime Minister. In the late 70's we had the Winter of discontent when the the then Labour Prime Minister Jim Callaghan tried to cap wages to try and control inflation...much like what the tories have done for seven years, capped wages to the poorest while the top 5% have had tax breaks and wage increases.
I would much rather put up with a few weeks of inconvenience than watch people being made homeless through the bedroom tax, watch people with learning difficulties not being able to understand bus timetables and being late for Jobseekers appointments and being sanctioned for weeks on end without a penny to live on. Watch someone suffering with diabetes not being able to eat properly or afford electricity to store insulin .Or watch someone who worked all their lives, paid their NI be struck down with Dementia or Alzheimer's and the only asset they own and have worked for to be taken away they can leave to their children...their family home. Or watch pensioners not being able to heat their homes through winter. Not that any of that would happen now because the Unions have no power, I'm suprised instead of strikes there's not anarchy on the streets.
I certainly know I would prefer a few weeks of that compared to the seven years we have had and worse to come. Just my opinion on how I see things
I know we aren't going to agree ....I just wanted to point out that things were not rosy in the 70s .....or at any other time......think 69s Cathy Come Home for homelessness .......and yes, I would like to think that the house I've worked all my life for wasn't going to be swallowed up paying for our care costs .....but on the other hand I guess there is an argument for saying why shouldn't I expect it for free if I have the assets .
I'm sorry I just don't believe Labours * we are going to do everything * promise ...in fact I think you are going to be very disappointed when /if they get into power. Promising the earth is easy in opposition , but it never translates into reality once any party....and I do mean any party ...gets into power . But time will tell
You're right Baz....after all, the Tories promised the earth too didn't they? Truth is, I'd much rather prefer Labour's version of promising the earth rather than the Tories.
Dame_Ann_Average posted:Baz posted:Oh and it wasn't a few weeks in the 70s ...it started in 1970 and went through the whole decade in one form or another....that's why we ended up with over a decade of bliddy Thatcher....
I did explain that Baz... Ted Heath was in power in the first half of the seventies ..it was 1973 and again in 78/79.
But the point that I was making was that it started in 1970.... with power cuts due to work to rule .....and I think ....although I might be wrong the It was Harold Wilson then.....the thing is it didn't matter which party was in power ....and again from memory there were two Labour PMs and two Conservative ....it was the unions and hardcore Left that caused the problems 
Baz posted:Dame_Ann_Average posted:Baz posted:Oh and it wasn't a few weeks in the 70s ...it started in 1970 and went through the whole decade in one form or another....that's why we ended up with over a decade of bliddy Thatcher....
I did explain that Baz... Ted Heath was in power in the first half of the seventies ..it was 1973 and again in 78/79.
But the point that I was making was that it started in 1970.... with power cuts due to work to rule .....and I think ....although I might be wrong the It was Harold Wilson then.....the thing is it didn't matter which party was in power ....and again from memory there were two Labour PMs and two Conservative ....it was the unions and hardcore Left that caused the problems
But things have changed now.......this is years on from that and to be fair go with what is happening now, rather than what happened then
Sprout posted:Baz posted:Dame_Ann_Average posted:Baz posted:Oh and it wasn't a few weeks in the 70s ...it started in 1970 and went through the whole decade in one form or another....that's why we ended up with over a decade of bliddy Thatcher....
I did explain that Baz... Ted Heath was in power in the first half of the seventies ..it was 1973 and again in 78/79.
But the point that I was making was that it started in 1970.... with power cuts due to work to rule .....and I think ....although I might be wrong the It was Harold Wilson then.....the thing is it didn't matter which party was in power ....and again from memory there were two Labour PMs and two Conservative ....it was the unions and hardcore Left that caused the problems
But things have changed now.......this is years on from that and to be fair go with what is happening now, rather than what happened then
And you don't think this manifesto is retrograde ?? It's not me that's going backwards
Baz posted:But the point that I was making was that it started in 1970.... with power cuts due to work to rule .....and I think ....although I might be wrong the It was Harold Wilson then.....the thing is it didn't matter which party was in power ....and again from memory there were two Labour PMs and two Conservative ....it was the unions and hardcore Left that caused the problems
In Sweden and Norway Corby would look quite Liberal, he's a socialist, This country has moved so far right Ted Heath would be called a Communist ..and they do much better than us to be fair.
Baz posted:Dame_Ann_Average posted:Baz posted:Oh and it wasn't a few weeks in the 70s ...it started in 1970 and went through the whole decade in one form or another....that's why we ended up with over a decade of bliddy Thatcher....
I did explain that Baz... Ted Heath was in power in the first half of the seventies ..it was 1973 and again in 78/79.
But the point that I was making was that it started in 1970.... with power cuts due to work to rule .....and I think ....although I might be wrong the It was Harold Wilson then.....the thing is it didn't matter which party was in power ....and again from memory there were two Labour PMs and two Conservative ....it was the unions and hardcore Left that caused the problems
No: that was Heath. It was the miners' strikes during his premiership that led to him imposing the Three-Day Week, and eventually losing the 1974 election. The strikes ended almost immediately after Labour came to power.
There is a theory that it was the repercussions of Heath's inability to deal with the unions (especially the miners) that partly led to Thatcher taking such a hard line in 1984.
The 1978-79 "Winter of Discontent" was under James Callaghan, though, and that of course led to Thatcher wining the 1979 election...
Eugene's Lair posted:Baz posted:Dame_Ann_Average posted:Baz posted:Oh and it wasn't a few weeks in the 70s ...it started in 1970 and went through the whole decade in one form or another....that's why we ended up with over a decade of bliddy Thatcher....
I did explain that Baz... Ted Heath was in power in the first half of the seventies ..it was 1973 and again in 78/79.
But the point that I was making was that it started in 1970.... with power cuts due to work to rule .....and I think ....although I might be wrong the It was Harold Wilson then.....the thing is it didn't matter which party was in power ....and again from memory there were two Labour PMs and two Conservative ....it was the unions and hardcore Left that caused the problems
No: that was Heath. It was the miners' strikes during his premiership that led to him imposing the Three-Day Week, and eventually losing the 1974 election. The strikes ended almost immediately after Labour came to power.
The 1978-79 "Winter of Discontent" was under James Callaghan, though, and that of course led to Thatcher wining the 1979 election...
I know all that Eugene .....I was there ....but I know it started in 1970 cos I was working for the electric board when the work to rule started the power cuts
Baz posted:Eugene's Lair posted:Baz posted:I know all that Eugene .....I was there
But it's different to that now Bazzy, all JC wants is a fair day's pay for a fair day's work
Sprout posted:Baz posted:Eugene's Lair posted:Baz posted:I know all that Eugene .....I was thereBut it's different to that now Bazzy, all JC wants is a fair day's pay for a fair day's work
That's what they said then too
Baz posted:Sprout posted:Baz posted:Eugene's Lair posted:Baz posted:I know all that Eugene .....I was thereBut it's different to that now Bazzy, all JC wants is a fair day's pay for a fair day's work
That's what they said then too
this time its in black + white..everything costed-even skynews said their expert has ran through it & it adds up
now we've got the benefit of social media, we dont have to believe what the daily mail etc.. feed us..we can read what experts tell us
and
they all say its a winner
BBC are flapping & dont know what to do with theirselves
so they either ignore, lie or twist the story round to suit their agenda
pirate1111 posted:this time its in black + white..everything costed-even skynews said their expert has ran through it & it adds up
now we've got the benefit of social media, we dont have to believe what the daily mail etc.. feed us..we can read what experts tell us
and
they all say its a winner
BBC are flapping & dont know what to do with theirselves
so they either ignore, lie or twist the story round to suit their agenda
succinctly put Pirate ..yet the BBC is still spinning the Tory line
I have just watched Diane Abbott being interviewed in Manchester about security, police numbers and troops in the streets. I have to say that I don't think she is the best mouthpiece for the Labour party.
I watched and listened quite carefully and she started out answering as though she was thinking about the next word, very stilted and comes across as someone not confident in what they are saying. I then noticed that when asked another question she started to answer and unlike most politicians who get interrupted she stopped dead and listened to the interjection, it felt very much like she was pleased she was interrupted, kind of 'phew, got through that'.
It may just be me, but I really don't rate her.
"JC, get another more confident and much more eloquent public speaker" ...QUICK.
To be fair EC and I don't rate her much either..I also find Theresa May completely useless without a script and I'm not believing this Operation Temperer either...we haven't enough police and that's why the army has been called in.
By the way, I though all campaigning was cancelled...Tory leaflet through my letterbox whilst I was out this afternoon and I have left a polite note on the door saying no Tory Crap, I think I'll have to be a bit more forceful 
Dame_Ann_Average posted:
To be fair EC and I don't rate her much either..I also find Theresa May completely useless without a script and I'm not believing this Operation Temperer either...we haven't enough police and that's why the army has been called in.
By the way, I though all campaigning was cancelled...Tory leaflet through my letterbox whilst I was out this afternoon and I have left a polite note on the door saying no Tory Crap, I think I'll have to be a bit more forceful
Well obviously they don't think that THEIR stuff is c***. It's the stuff that ANTI-Tories must be shoving through your door, to which you refer!
Extremely Fluffy Fluffy Thing posted:Well obviously they don't think that THEIR stuff is c***. It's the stuff that ANTI-Tories must be shoving through your door, to which you refer!
I said only Greens or Labour leaflets...I'm going to be in most of the day tomorrow and I hope I catch them
a facebook friend of mine posted this, I thought I would share.
"Here's what I'm really struggling to understand...
All I've ever heard from people, for years, is
"bloody bankers and their bonuses"
"bloody rich and their offshore tax havens "
"bloody politicians with their lying and second homes"
âbloody corporations paying less tax than meâ
"bloody Establishment, they're all in it togetherâ
âit'll never change, there's no point in votingâ
And quite rightly so, I said all the same things.
But then someone comes along that's different. He upsets the bankers and the rich.
The Tory politicians hate him along with most of the Labour politicians. The corporations throw more money at the politicians to keep him quiet. And the Establishment is visibly shaken. I've never seen the Establishment so genuinely scared of a single person.
So the media arm of the establishment gets involved. Theresa phones Rupert asking what he can do, and he tells her to keep her mouth shut, don't do the live debate, he'll sort this out. So the media goes into overdrive withâĶ
âshe's strong and stableâ
âhe's a clownâ
âhe's not a leaderâ
âlook he can't even control his own partyâ
âhe'll ruin the economyâ
âhow's he gonna pay for it all?!â
âAND he's a terrorist sympathiser, burn him, burn the terrorist sympathiserâ
And what do we? We've waited forever for an honest politician to come along but instead of getting behind him we bow to the establishment like good little workers. They whistle and we do a little dance for them.
We run around like hypnotised robots repeating headlines we've read, all nodding and agreeing. Feeling really proud of ourselves because we think we've came up with our very own first political opinion. But we haven't, we haven't came up with anything. This is how you tell. No matter where someone lives in the country, they're repeating the same headlines, word for word. From Cornwall to Newcastle people are saying
âhe's a clownâ
âheâs a threat to the countryâ
âshe's strong and stableâ
âhe'll take us back to the 70sâ
And there's nothing else, there's no further opinion. There's no evidence apart from 1 radio 5 interview that isn't even concrete evidence, he actually condemns the violence of both sides in the interview. Theres no data or studies or official reports to back anything up. Try and think really hard why you think he's a clown, other than the fact he looks like a geography teacher. (no offence geography teachers) Because he hasn't done anything clownish from what I've seen.
And you're not on this planet if you think the establishment and the media aren't all in it together.
You think Richard Branson, who's quietly winning NHS contracts, wants Corbyn in?
You think Rupert Murdoch, who's currently trying to widen his media monopoly by buying sky outright, wants Jeremy in?
You think the Barclay brothers, with their offshore residencies, want him in?
You think Philip Green, who stole all the pensions from BHS workers and claims his wife owns Topshop because she lives in Monaco, wants Corbyn in?
You think the politicians, both Labour and Tory, with their second homes and alcohol paid for by us, want him in?
You think Starbucks, paying near zero tax, wants him in?
You think bankers, with their multi million pound bonuses, want him in?
And do you think they don't have contact with May? Or with the media? You honestly think that these millionaires and billionaires are the sort of people that go âah well, easy come easy go, it was nice while it lastedâ?? I wouldn't be if my personal fortune was at risk, I'd be straight on the phone to Theresa May or Rupert Murdoch demanding this gets sorted immediately.
Because here's a man, a politician that doesn't lie, he can't lie, he could have said whatever would get him votes anytime he wanted but he hasn't. He lives in a normal house like us and uses the bus just like us.
He's fought for justice and peace for nearly 40 years. He has no career ambitions. And his seat is untouchable. That's one of the greatest testimonies. No one comes close to removing him from his constituency, election after election.
His Manifesto is fully costed. It all adds up, yes there's some borrowing but that's just to renationalise the railway, you know we already subsidise them and they make profit yeah? One more timeâĶ WE subsidise the railway companies and they walk away with a profit, just try and grasp the level of piss taking going on there. Unlike the tory manifesto with a ÂĢ9 billion hole, their figures don't even add up.
And it benefits all of us, young, old, working, disabled, everyone.
The only people it hurts are the establishment, the rich, the bankers, the top 5% highest earners.
Good, **** them, it's long overdue."
Dame_Ann_Average posted:
a facebook friend of mine posted this, I thought I would share.
"Here's what I'm really struggling to understand...
All I've ever heard from people, for years, is
"bloody bankers and their bonuses"
"bloody rich and their offshore tax havens "
"bloody politicians with their lying and second homes"
âbloody corporations paying less tax than meâ
"bloody Establishment, they're all in it togetherâ
âit'll never change, there's no point in votingâ
And quite rightly so, I said all the same things.
But then someone comes along that's different. He upsets the bankers and the rich.
The Tory politicians hate him along with most of the Labour politicians. The corporations throw more money at the politicians to keep him quiet. And the Establishment is visibly shaken. I've never seen the Establishment so genuinely scared of a single person.
So the media arm of the establishment gets involved. Theresa phones Rupert asking what he can do, and he tells her to keep her mouth shut, don't do the live debate, he'll sort this out. So the media goes into overdrive withâĶ
âshe's strong and stableâ
âhe's a clownâ
âhe's not a leaderâ
âlook he can't even control his own partyâ
âhe'll ruin the economyâ
âhow's he gonna pay for it all?!â
âAND he's a terrorist sympathiser, burn him, burn the terrorist sympathiserâ
And what do we? We've waited forever for an honest politician to come along but instead of getting behind him we bow to the establishment like good little workers. They whistle and we do a little dance for them.
We run around like hypnotised robots repeating headlines we've read, all nodding and agreeing. Feeling really proud of ourselves because we think we've came up with our very own first political opinion. But we haven't, we haven't came up with anything. This is how you tell. No matter where someone lives in the country, they're repeating the same headlines, word for word. From Cornwall to Newcastle people are saying
âhe's a clownâ
âheâs a threat to the countryâ
âshe's strong and stableâ
âhe'll take us back to the 70sâ
And there's nothing else, there's no further opinion. There's no evidence apart from 1 radio 5 interview that isn't even concrete evidence, he actually condemns the violence of both sides in the interview. Theres no data or studies or official reports to back anything up. Try and think really hard why you think he's a clown, other than the fact he looks like a geography teacher. (no offence geography teachers) Because he hasn't done anything clownish from what I've seen.
And you're not on this planet if you think the establishment and the media aren't all in it together.
You think Richard Branson, who's quietly winning NHS contracts, wants Corbyn in?
You think Rupert Murdoch, who's currently trying to widen his media monopoly by buying sky outright, wants Jeremy in?
You think the Barclay brothers, with their offshore residencies, want him in?
You think Philip Green, who stole all the pensions from BHS workers and claims his wife owns Topshop because she lives in Monaco, wants Corbyn in?
You think the politicians, both Labour and Tory, with their second homes and alcohol paid for by us, want him in?
You think Starbucks, paying near zero tax, wants him in?
You think bankers, with their multi million pound bonuses, want him in?
And do you think they don't have contact with May? Or with the media? You honestly think that these millionaires and billionaires are the sort of people that go âah well, easy come easy go, it was nice while it lastedâ?? I wouldn't be if my personal fortune was at risk, I'd be straight on the phone to Theresa May or Rupert Murdoch demanding this gets sorted immediately.
Because here's a man, a politician that doesn't lie, he can't lie, he could have said whatever would get him votes anytime he wanted but he hasn't. He lives in a normal house like us and uses the bus just like us.
He's fought for justice and peace for nearly 40 years. He has no career ambitions. And his seat is untouchable. That's one of the greatest testimonies. No one comes close to removing him from his constituency, election after election.
His Manifesto is fully costed. It all adds up, yes there's some borrowing but that's just to renationalise the railway, you know we already subsidise them and they make profit yeah? One more timeâĶ WE subsidise the railway companies and they walk away with a profit, just try and grasp the level of piss taking going on there. Unlike the tory manifesto with a ÂĢ9 billion hole, their figures don't even add up.
And it benefits all of us, young, old, working, disabled, everyone.
The only people it hurts are the establishment, the rich, the bankers, the top 5% highest earners.
Good, **** them, it's long overdue."
desperate stuff
http://www.huffingtonpost.co.u...6pLid%3D962317545_uk
and lies by Fallon again, my hatred for the Tories never ceases to amaze me as I don't generally hate anyone or thing, I can honestly say my hate grows daily at their greed, evilness and spite on millions in this country.
http://www.huffingtonpost.co.u...pLid%3D1979366677_uk
WTF on the first one!! 
And I don't quite know what to say on the second one. If it wasn't so stoopid, it would be funny And the thing is.....he really believes it!
Sprout posted:WTF on the first one!!
And I don't quite know what to say on the second one. If it wasn't so stoopid, it would be funny
it's gone past right wing propaganda to ridiculous 
Dame_Ann_Average posted:Sprout posted:WTF on the first one!!
And I don't quite know what to say on the second one. If it wasn't so stoopid, it would be funny
it's gone past right wing propaganda to ridiculous
I think the Labour party are being quite sensible in my area. We are a massively strong Labour region, I note that we have had no leaflet drops as yet. Green thinking which I appreciate.
I find Dianne Abbott annoying and impossible to understand...something about her pattern of speech as well as what she comes out with...so labour have her and the Tories have Boris..kind of cancel each other out
brainwash alert for tonight
I have just seen something along similar lines on Reporting Scotland. Tories spouting rubbish and lies about other parties and how they are the only ones who can save us!
Extremely Fluffy Fluffy Thing posted:I have just seen something along similar lines on Reporting Scotland. Tories spouting rubbish and lies about other parties and how they are the only ones who can save us!
It really is scary stuff
Extremely Fluffy Fluffy Thing posted:I have just seen something along similar lines on Reporting Scotland. Tories spouting rubbish and lies about other parties and how they are the only ones who can save us!
As far as I'm concerned, they are the only ones who can save us, up here!
Yogi19 posted:Extremely Fluffy Fluffy Thing posted:I have just seen something along similar lines on Reporting Scotland. Tories spouting rubbish and lies about other parties and how they are the only ones who can save us!
As far as I'm concerned, they are the only ones who can save us, up here!
Well.....if Nic gets her way and Scotland goes separate, you can have them up there. I don't want them down here
Sprout posted:Well.....if Nic gets her way and Scotland goes separate, you can have them up there. I don't want them down here
Happy to have them.
I'd be even happier if I could send Sturgeon down to you.
Sound like a fair swap?
Yogi19 posted:Sprout posted:Well.....if Nic gets her way and Scotland goes separate, you can have them up there. I don't want them down here
Happy to have them.
I'd be even happier if I could send Sturgeon down to you.
Sound like a fair swap?
I don't like Nic either, but she's a bloody sight better than May and her government
Yogi19 posted:Sprout posted:Well.....if Nic gets her way and Scotland goes separate, you can have them up there. I don't want them down here
Happy to have them.
I'd be even happier if I could send Sturgeon down to you.
Sound like a fair swap?
No ta....there's a limit to friendship you know 
Corbyn can't seem to make his mind up about Scotland though ...one minute he's not wanting to get into bed with the SNP, next he's saying he will consider looking into to a second referendum ....strikes me the man will say anything.... and promise everything to everyone ....simply to get into power
Yogi19 posted:Extremely Fluffy Fluffy Thing posted:I have just seen something along similar lines on Reporting Scotland. Tories spouting rubbish and lies about other parties and how they are the only ones who can save us!
As far as I'm concerned, they are the only ones who can save us, up here!
Really? I see them destroying ALL parts of the UK!
Yogi19 posted:Sprout posted:Well.....if Nic gets her way and Scotland goes separate, you can have them up there. I don't want them down here
Happy to have them.
I'd be even happier if I could send Sturgeon down to you.
Sound like a fair swap?
Yogi, Yogi, Yogi ... I love reading this thread, because I like to read opinions from all sides.
But this? Nooooo, this is not fair, too much, too far, and probably (and if it's not, it really should be) illegal!
Sprout posted:Yogi19 posted:Sprout posted:Well.....if Nic gets her way and Scotland goes separate, you can have them up there. I don't want them down here
Happy to have them.
I'd be even happier if I could send Sturgeon down to you.
Sound like a fair swap?
I don't like Nic either, but she's a bloody sight better than May and her government
I beg to differ.
Baz posted:Yogi19 posted:Sprout posted:Well.....if Nic gets her way and Scotland goes separate, you can have them up there. I don't want them down here
Happy to have them.
I'd be even happier if I could send Sturgeon down to you.
Sound like a fair swap?
Bit like May
Paxo's a pompous prick, isn't he?
Rexi posted:Yogi19 posted:Sprout posted:Well.....if Nic gets her way and Scotland goes separate, you can have them up there. I don't want them down here
Happy to have them.
I'd be even happier if I could send Sturgeon down to you.
Sound like a fair swap?
Yogi, Yogi, Yogi ... I love reading this thread, because I like to read opinions from all sides.
But this? Nooooo, this is not fair, too much, too far, and probably (and if it's not, it really should be) illegal!
I'm getting desperate, Rexi. I need to get rid of her somehow!
Rexi posted:Yogi19 posted:Sprout posted:Well.....if Nic gets her way and Scotland goes separate, you can have them up there. I don't want them down here
Happy to have them.
I'd be even happier if I could send Sturgeon down to you.
Sound like a fair swap?
Yogi, Yogi, Yogi ... I love reading this thread, because I like to read opinions from all sides.
But this? Nooooo, this is not fair, too much, too far, and probably (and if it's not, it really should be) illegal!
Yogi19 posted:Sprout posted:Yogi19 posted:Sprout posted:Well.....if Nic gets her way and Scotland goes separate, you can have them up there. I don't want them down here
Happy to have them.
I'd be even happier if I could send Sturgeon down to you.
Sound like a fair swap?
I don't like Nic either, but she's a bloody sight better than May and her government
I beg to differ.
Ok, so we have a difference of opinion. And I'll bet we're not the only ones
Baz posted:Yogi19 posted:Sprout posted:Well.....if Nic gets her way and Scotland goes separate, you can have them up there. I don't want them down here
Happy to have them.
I'd be even happier if I could send Sturgeon down to you.
Sound like a fair swap?
Changed his mind oftener than his socks on the second referendum issue
Kaffs posted:Paxo's a pompous prick, isn't he?
Sprout posted:Baz posted:Yogi19 posted:Sprout posted:Well.....if Nic gets her way and Scotland goes separate, you can have them up there. I don't want them down here
Happy to have them.
I'd be even happier if I could send Sturgeon down to you.
Sound like a fair swap?
Bit like May
Whatever you think of May you can't lay that one on her ....not after her manifesto
Yogi19 posted:Rexi posted:Yogi19 posted:Sprout posted:Well.....if Nic gets her way and Scotland goes separate, you can have them up there. I don't want them down here
Happy to have them.
I'd be even happier if I could send Sturgeon down to you.
Sound like a fair swap?
Yogi, Yogi, Yogi ... I love reading this thread, because I like to read opinions from all sides.
But this? Nooooo, this is not fair, too much, too far, and probably (and if it's not, it really should be) illegal!
Take heart ... Cameron was my MP xxx
Yogi19 posted:Baz posted:Yogi19 posted:Sprout posted:Well.....if Nic gets her way and Scotland goes separate, you can have them up there. I don't want them down here
Happy to have them.
I'd be even happier if I could send Sturgeon down to you.
Sound like a fair swap?
Yogi19 posted:Baz posted:Yogi19 posted:Sprout posted:Well.....if Nic gets her way and Scotland goes separate, you can have them up there. I don't want them down here
Happy to have them.
I'd be even happier if I could send Sturgeon down to you.
Sound like a fair swap?
And she hasn't changed her mind on things....or lied?
Rexi posted:Yogi19 posted:Rexi posted:Yogi19 posted:Sprout posted:Well.....if Nic gets her way and Scotland goes separate, you can have them up there. I don't want them down here
Happy to have them.
I'd be even happier if I could send Sturgeon down to you.
Sound like a fair swap?
Yogi, Yogi, Yogi ... I love reading this thread, because I like to read opinions from all sides.
But this? Nooooo, this is not fair, too much, too far, and probably (and if it's not, it really should be) illegal!
Take heart ... Cameron was my MP xxx
Rofl Mind you I think I'd rather Cameron than the Crankie
Baz posted:Sprout posted:Baz posted:
Bit like May
Ok, what's she promised that's gonna benefit the country? and that said....manifesto is uncosted
Extremely Fluffy Fluffy Thing posted:Yogi19 posted:Extremely Fluffy Fluffy Thing posted:I have just seen something along similar lines on Reporting Scotland. Tories spouting rubbish and lies about other parties and how they are the only ones who can save us!
As far as I'm concerned, they are the only ones who can save us, up here!
Really? I see them destroying ALL parts of the UK!
As far as I'm concerned, they are the only ones who can halt the SNP Independence train and that's why I added "up here".
We are at opposite ends of this one, Fluffs but I respect your right to your opinion, even though I don't agree with you.
Baz posted:Rexi posted:Yogi19 posted:Rexi posted:Yogi19 posted:Sprout posted:Well.....if Nic gets her way and Scotland goes separate, you can have them up there. I don't want them down here
Happy to have them.
I'd be even happier if I could send Sturgeon down to you.
Sound like a fair swap?
Yogi, Yogi, Yogi ... I love reading this thread, because I like to read opinions from all sides.
But this? Nooooo, this is not fair, too much, too far, and probably (and if it's not, it really should be) illegal!
Take heart ... Cameron was my MP xxx
Rofl
Ditto!!
Sprout posted:Yogi19 posted:Baz posted:Yogi19 posted:Sprout posted:Well.....if Nic gets her way and Scotland goes separate, you can have them up there. I don't want them down here
Happy to have them.
I'd be even happier if I could send Sturgeon down to you.
Sound like a fair swap?
And she hasn't changed her mind on things....or lied?
Are you saying Corbyn changed his mind....or lied?
I really hope someone goes after her like they've gone after Jeremy tonight
Sprout posted:Baz posted:Sprout posted:Baz posted:
Bit like May
Ok, what's she promised that's gonna benefit the country? and that said....manifesto is uncosted
Not a lot Sprout ....that's my point ....you can hardly accuse her of promising the earth like Corbyn ....in fact the total opposite
Yogi19 posted:Baz posted:Rexi posted:Yogi19 posted:Rexi posted:Yogi19 posted:Sprout posted:Well.....if Nic gets her way and Scotland goes separate, you can have them up there. I don't want them down here
Happy to have them.
I'd be even happier if I could send Sturgeon down to you.
Sound like a fair swap?
Yogi, Yogi, Yogi ... I love reading this thread, because I like to read opinions from all sides.
But this? Nooooo, this is not fair, too much, too far, and probably (and if it's not, it really should be) illegal!
Take heart ... Cameron was my MP xxx
Rofl
Ditto!!
Dunno ladiezzz, I think maybe wee Crankie has the country's best interests at heart, Cameron ... well, it was ever all about him.
Yogi19 posted:Extremely Fluffy Fluffy Thing posted:Yogi19 posted:Extremely Fluffy Fluffy Thing posted:I have just seen something along similar lines on Reporting Scotland. Tories spouting rubbish and lies about other parties and how they are the only ones who can save us!
As far as I'm concerned, they are the only ones who can save us, up here!
Really? I see them destroying ALL parts of the UK!
As far as I'm concerned, they are the only ones who can halt the SNP Independence train and that's why I added "up here".
We are at opposite ends of this one, Fluffs but I respect your right to your opinion, even though I don't agree with you.
Likewise Yogi!
Sprout posted:Kaffs posted:Paxo's a pompous prick, isn't he?
Summed up on Twitter 'he sounds like a drunk, belligerent, arsehole'
Yogi19 posted:Sprout posted:Yogi19 posted:Baz posted:Yogi19 posted:Sprout posted:Well.....if Nic gets her way and Scotland goes separate, you can have them up there. I don't want them down here
Happy to have them.
I'd be even happier if I could send Sturgeon down to you.
Sound like a fair swap?
And she hasn't changed her mind on things....or lied?
Are you saying Corbyn changed his mind....or lied?
Exactly What I can't seem to get across is that all politicians do that ....whether you think it's lying , or changing their mind depends on whether you support that particular politician ...
Rexi posted:Yogi19 posted:Baz posted:Rexi posted:Yogi19 posted:Rexi posted:Yogi19 posted:Sprout posted:Well.....if Nic gets her way and Scotland goes separate, you can have them up there. I don't want them down here
Happy to have them.
I'd be even happier if I could send Sturgeon down to you.
Sound like a fair swap?
Yogi, Yogi, Yogi ... I love reading this thread, because I like to read opinions from all sides.
But this? Nooooo, this is not fair, too much, too far, and probably (and if it's not, it really should be) illegal!
Take heart ... Cameron was my MP xxx
Rofl
Ditto!!
Dunno ladiezzz, I think maybe wee Crankie has the country's best interests at heart, Cameron ... well, it was ever all about him.
Crankie only has one thing at heart and that's Independence. She would bring Scotland to its knees to attain that.
Baz posted:Sprout posted:Ok, what's she promised that's gonna benefit the country? and that said....manifesto is uncostedNot a lot Sprout ....that's my point ....you can hardly accuse her of promising the earth like Corbyn ....in fact the total opposite
That's the thing though, he doesn't promise the earth. It's all been costed out
Baz posted:Yogi19 posted:Sprout posted:Yogi19 posted:Baz posted:Yogi19 posted:Sprout posted:Well.....if Nic gets her way and Scotland goes separate, you can have them up there. I don't want them down here
Happy to have them.
I'd be even happier if I could send Sturgeon down to you.
Sound like a fair swap?
And she hasn't changed her mind on things....or lied?
Are you saying Corbyn changed his mind....or lied?
Exactly
Spot on
Yogi19 posted:Crankie only has one thing at heart and that's Independence. She would bring Scotland to its knees to attain that.
Surely that will never happen?
Sprout posted:Baz posted:Sprout posted:Ok, what's she promised that's gonna benefit the country? and that said....manifesto is uncostedNot a lot Sprout ....that's my point ....you can hardly accuse her of promising the earth like Corbyn ....in fact the total opposite
That's the thing though, he doesn't promise the earth. It's all been costed out
He has ...even offering football fans special tickets As for the costings, the IFS ....which is independent ....has said their are big holes in both parties costings....
Rexi posted:Yogi19 posted:Crankie only has one thing at heart and that's Independence. She would bring Scotland to its knees to attain that.
Surely that will never happen?
Independence or bringing the country to its knees?
Yogi19 posted:Rexi posted:Yogi19 posted:Crankie only has one thing at heart and that's Independence. She would bring Scotland to its knees to attain that.
Surely that will never happen?
Independence or bringing the country to its knees?
I meant independence ... but I suppose it's one and the same?
Yogi19 posted:Rexi posted:Yogi19 posted:Crankie only has one thing at heart and that's Independence. She would bring Scotland to its knees to attain that.
Surely that will never happen?
Independence or bringing the country to its knees?
Was about to ask the same question.
Baz posted:Sprout posted:Baz posted:Sprout posted:Ok, what's she promised that's gonna benefit the country? and that said....manifesto is uncostedNot a lot Sprout ....that's my point ....you can hardly accuse her of promising the earth like Corbyn ....in fact the total opposite
That's the thing though, he doesn't promise the earth. It's all been costed out
He has ...even offering football fans special tickets
A drop in the ocean to the other problems in this country, and yes, there may be holes but I'll wager there's bigger holes in the Tory party costings than there are in the Labour Party's
Rexi posted:Yogi19 posted:Rexi posted:Yogi19 posted:Crankie only has one thing at heart and that's Independence. She would bring Scotland to its knees to attain that.
Surely that will never happen?
Independence or bringing the country to its knees?
I meant independence ... but I suppose it's one and the same?
It is, imo.
Recent polls show that support for Independence has gone down since the last referendum, thank goodness.
Extremely Fluffy Fluffy Thing posted:Yogi19 posted:Rexi posted:Yogi19 posted:Crankie only has one thing at heart and that's Independence. She would bring Scotland to its knees to attain that.
Surely that will never happen?
Independence or bringing the country to its knees?
Was about to ask the same question.
Rexi posted:Yogi19 posted:Rexi posted:Yogi19 posted:Crankie only has one thing at heart and that's Independence. She would bring Scotland to its knees to attain that.
Surely that will never happen?
Independence or bringing the country to its knees?
I meant independence ... but I suppose it's one and the same?
Not exactly.....Bringing the country to it's knees(given that scenario) wouldn't guarantee independence, IMO.
Sprout posted:Baz posted:Sprout posted:Baz posted:Sprout posted:Ok, what's she promised that's gonna benefit the country? and that said....manifesto is uncostedNot a lot Sprout ....that's my point ....you can hardly accuse her of promising the earth like Corbyn ....in fact the total opposite
That's the thing though, he doesn't promise the earth. It's all been costed out
He has ...even offering football fans special tickets
A drop in the ocean to the other problems in this country, and yes, there may be holes, but I'll wager there's bigger holes in the Tory party costings than there are in the Labour Party's
Well time will tell .....and it will be interesting to see how many of the myriad of promises he's made will actually come to fruition if he gets in power ....I'm guessing not many , cos they are already talking about this review and that review ....but if they do how much it will cost us all ....
Extremely Fluffy Fluffy Thing posted:Rexi posted:Yogi19 posted:Rexi posted:Yogi19 posted:Crankie only has one thing at heart and that's Independence. She would bring Scotland to its knees to attain that.
Surely that will never happen?
Independence or bringing the country to its knees?
I meant independence ... but I suppose it's one and the same?
Not exactly.....Bringing the country to it's knees(given that scenario) wouldn't guarantee independence, IMO.
Independence would bring the country to its knees, imo.
Sprout posted:Baz posted:Sprout posted:Baz posted:Sprout posted:Ok, what's she promised that's gonna benefit the country? and that said....manifesto is uncostedNot a lot Sprout ....that's my point ....you can hardly accuse her of promising the earth like Corbyn ....in fact the total opposite
That's the thing though, he doesn't promise the earth. It's all been costed out
He has ...even offering football fans special tickets
A drop in the ocean to the other problems in this country, and yes, there may be holes but I'll wager there's bigger holes in the Tory party costings than there are in the Labour Party's
And yes , exactly, so it can only be in order to gain votes
Extremely Fluffy Fluffy Thing posted:Rexi posted:Yogi19 posted:Rexi posted:Yogi19 posted:Crankie only has one thing at heart and that's Independence. She would bring Scotland to its knees to attain that.
Surely that will never happen?
Independence or bringing the country to its knees?
I meant independence ... but I suppose it's one and the same?
Not exactly.....Bringing the country to it's knees(given that scenario) wouldn't guarantee independence, IMO.
Ah well, I dip out now Fluffs, upu know a lot more abput this than me
Yogi19 posted:
Recent polls show that support for Independence has gone down since the last referendum, thank goodness.
Extremely Fluffy Fluffy Thing posted:Not exactly.....Bringing the country to it's knees(given that scenario) wouldn't guarantee independence, IMO.
Oh dear, we differ again!
Says a lot when the audience erupts into spontaneous laughter and heckles the PM when she refers to the costing of the Labour manifesto. Where's your sums then Tess?
Baz posted:Sprout posted:A drop in the ocean to the other problems in this country, and yes, there may be holes, but I'll wager there's bigger holes in the Tory party costings than there are in the Labour Party's
Well time will tell .....and it will be interesting to see how many of the myriad of promises he's made will actually come to fruition if he gets in power ....I'm guessing not many , cos they are already talking about this review and that review ....but if they do how much it will cost us all ....
You're right, time will tell
But it's the same with a Tory Government. How much of what they say they'll do will come to fruition, given the fact that they've got no costs for things
And I welcome reviews.....it might stop us haemoraging (sp) money to those who shouldn't have it.....namely the fat cats
Extremely Fluffy Fluffy Thing posted:Yogi19 posted:
Recent polls show that support for Independence has gone down since the last referendum, thank goodness.
Extremely Fluffy Fluffy Thing posted:Not exactly.....Bringing the country to it's knees(given that scenario) wouldn't guarantee independence, IMO.
Oh dear, we differ again!
No!
Kaffs posted:Says a lot when the audience erupts into spontaneous laughter and heckles the PM when she refers to the costing of the Labour manifesto. Where's your sums then Tess?
Let's see how Paxo does with her Hmmmm
Sprout posted:Let's see how Paxo does with her
Yes, this'll be interesting. If he doesn't get all 'drunk at the end of the bar' with her, I'll be livid. Another Twitter quote...
Corbyn adopting the tone with Paxo of a kindly neighbour explaining to the oddball next door why the bins must be put out on a Tuesday
Sprout posted:Baz posted:Sprout posted:A drop in the ocean to the other problems in this country, and yes, there may be holes, but I'll wager there's bigger holes in the Tory party costings than there are in the Labour Party's
Well time will tell .....and it will be interesting to see how many of the myriad of promises he's made will actually come to fruition if he gets in power ....I'm guessing not many , cos they are already talking about this review and that review ....but if they do how much it will cost us all ....
You're right, time will tell
But it's the same with a Tory Government. How much of what they say they'll do will come to fruition, given the fact that they've got no costs for things
And I welcome reviews.....it might stop us haemoraging (sp) money to those who shouldn't have it.....namely the fat cats
But I don't believe everything the Tories say either Sprout ...so it won't come as much of a shock to me .........it's the blind acceptance that Labour is all good ....Tories all bad ...that I find amusing ...as for the fat cats ....without a few of those this country would be facing even more austerity .....even the communists found that out the hard way
Baz posted:But I don't believe everything the Tories say either Sprout ...so it won't come as much of a shock to me .....
Neither do I
I'm not saying that Labour is all good either. I'm just saying that they'll be fairer where the cuts are made
As for the fat cats, I can't believe you just said that Bazzy
I'm slightly mollified that Paxo's just as big an idiot with her.
Oooft. I might even like him a little bit now.
Kaffs posted:I'm slightly mollified that Paxo's just as big an idiot with her.
Sprout posted:Baz posted:But I don't believe everything the Tories say either Sprout ...so it won't come as much of a shock to me .....
Neither do I
I'm not saying that Labour is all good either. I'm just saying that they'll be fairer where the cuts are made
As for the fat cats, I can't believe you just said that Bazzy
But how do you think we will get all the money to run the country if we don't have the so called fat cats running business etc that give people work and tax into the system ? I want a country that raises people's standards and spiral ions ...not dumbs them down . That's not to say I don't think they...higher earners .... shouldn't contribute more ....I just don't think you can blame them for all societies ills ....
Baz posted:Sprout posted:Baz posted:But I don't believe everything the Tories say either Sprout ...so it won't come as much of a shock to me .....
Neither do I
I'm not saying that Labour is all good either. I'm just saying that they'll be fairer where the cuts are made
As for the fat cats, I can't believe you just said that Bazzy
I'm not blaming them for ALL society's ills but if they didn't cream off most of the money that they make for their pockets instead of putting it back in to the country, maybe we just might be in a better situation. I'm not above people making a profit, but there's profits and there's profits
Baz posted:Sprout posted:Baz posted:But I don't believe everything the Tories say either Sprout ...so it won't come as much of a shock to me .....
Neither do I
I'm not saying that Labour is all good either. I'm just saying that they'll be fairer where the cuts are made
As for the fat cats, I can't believe you just said that Bazzy
So how many Spiral Ions do you have?
Extremely Fluffy Fluffy Thing posted:Baz posted:Sprout posted:Baz posted:But I don't believe everything the Tories say either Sprout ...so it won't come as much of a shock to me .....
Neither do I
I'm not saying that Labour is all good either. I'm just saying that they'll be fairer where the cuts are made
As for the fat cats, I can't believe you just said that Bazzy
Trust you to find it ....make that aspirations !
I think Corbyn wiped the floor with May there - and they both wiped the floor with Paxman.
Kaffs posted:I think Corbyn wiped the floor with May there - and they both wiped the floor with Paxman.
That's why she doesn't want a face to face debate, cos she knows she'll lose
I knew that it was supposed to be aspirations, but it was just so ludicrous!
Kaffs posted:I think Corbyn wiped the floor with May there - and they both wiped the floor with Paxman.
I don't think so, Paxman hit the nail on the head with his comment about May being "a blowhard who collapses at the first sign of gunfire."
May's interview was a car crash. The Tory media will go into overdrive to protect her. The audience were laughing at her. They weren't laughing at Corbyn, so often the barn door target for the rightist media.
Just think, if the audience laughed at her, what are skilled negotiators employed by the EU going to do? What will Trump do? What will Putin do?
Carnelian posted:Kaffs posted:I think Corbyn wiped the floor with May there - and they both wiped the floor with Paxman.
I don't think so, Paxman hit the nail on the head with his comment about May being "a blowhard who collapses at the first sign of gunfire."
May's interview was a car crash. The Tory media will go into overdrive to protect her. The audience were laughing at her. They weren't laughing at Corbyn, so often the barn door target for the rightist media.
Just think, if the audience laughed at her, what are skilled negotiators employed by the EU going to do? What will Trump do? What will Putin do?
I agree.. scary. I did briefly warm to Paxman when he hit her with that comment (see my posts above) but mostly he was completely ineffectual imo He's being ridiculed almost as much as May from things I've seen online. I was most impressed by Corbyn's responses though. I'd love to think there was a glimmer of hope. Not that there's anything I can do up here that'll make a difference.
Theresa May has asked voters to picture Corbyn naked in Brussels as she urged voters to consider the impact of propelling Mr Corbyn to No 10.
Really?
Can you imagine Jeremy Corbyn saying this....she is a despicable cow, how anyone can vote for her is beyond me.
Dame_Ann_Average posted:Theresa May has asked voters to picture Corbyn naked in Brussels as she urged voters to consider the impact of propelling Mr Corbyn to No 10.
Really?
Can you imagine Jeremy Corbyn saying this....she is a despicable cow, how anyone can vote for her is beyond me.
Dame_Ann_Average posted:Theresa May has asked voters to picture Corbyn naked in Brussels as she urged voters to consider the impact of propelling Mr Corbyn to No 10.
Really?
Can you imagine Jeremy Corbyn saying this....she is a despicable cow, how anyone can vote for her is beyond me.
I saw that - beggars belief, eh? They do say it's a great tactic though - if someone frightens you, picture them naked. I feel physically sick at thought of her staying in power. It's almost as unbelievable as people voting for Trump in my book. How can you vote for a party whose campaign is refusing to explain how they plan to achieve their aims, making personal comments about the opposition and very little else?
I was fizzing yesterday at the screeds written about Corbyn wanting to check his facts rather than give wrong information but nothing's said about the Tory refusal to actually state any facts (and yes for 'facts' you can read 'intentions' and say they may not come to fruition, but they are at least stating their aims)
They went into overdrive yesterday because he didn't have the figures at hand, the BBC were buzzing...we can ignore Mays lack of costing, lack of policies and that she's going to make her mind up after the election...Corbyn made a mistake. David Dimbleby came out and spoke about the unfairness by the press and reporters towards Jeremy Corbyn, that really shocked me
The thought of another five years of her terrifies me too Kaffs. I can't for the life of me understand where the compassion and empathy has gone from the people of the UK . It seems as if no-one cares that they are ripping the NHS apart, making thousands homeless, people having to go cap in hand to food banks and have vaguely promised more of the same ..it beggars belief.
Best quote I saw yesterday was the only numbers in the Tory manifesto was the page numbers.
Retweeted Barry Gardiner (@BarryGardiner):
Labour leader does not instantly recall a figure: Headline news.
@theresa_may manifesto says a child's breakfast costs 6.8pence
No Problem
The bottom line is that everyone can always find evidence to support the way they think , but the truth is that people vote the way they feel is right ...and whether others choose to believe it or not , no one consciously wants to make life worse for themselves , or others . Moreover it's a pity there is not more respect for that ...cos that tolerance truly would make the world a better place !!
But come the revolution the country will decide , and whether it's Labour or Conservative ....or a hung parliament .....the sun will come up , and the world will keep on turning . And on that note I think it's time for me to bow out
Kaffs posted:Dame_Ann_Average posted:Theresa May has asked voters to picture Corbyn naked in Brussels as she urged voters to consider the impact of propelling Mr Corbyn to No 10.
Really?
Can you imagine Jeremy Corbyn saying this....she is a despicable cow, how anyone can vote for her is beyond me.
I saw that - beggars belief, eh? They do say it's a great tactic though - if someone frightens you, picture them naked. I feel physically sick at thought of her staying in power. It's almost as unbelievable as people voting for Trump in my book. How can you vote for a party whose campaign is refusing to explain how they plan to achieve their aims, making personal comments about the opposition and very little else?
I was fizzing yesterday at the screeds written about Corbyn wanting to check his facts rather than give wrong information but nothing's said about the Tory refusal to actually state any facts (and yes for 'facts' you can read 'intentions' and say they may not come to fruition, but they are at least stating their aims)
IMO:
He knew he was going to discuss his childcare proposals, so why wasn't he prepared? It's his policy, so why is it unfair to expect him to know the figures?
The Tories are being castigated for not putting a figure on things but Corbyn and Diane Abbot can't even remember the figures they have set.
IMO, the Labour Manifesto reads like the political equivalent of a child's Christmas Present Wish List. Even a four year old knows they won't get everything on their list - so if Labour do get in, I hope they brace themselves for a backlash from very disappointed Labour voters, when Corbyn can't deliver.
Pie crust promises - easily made and easily broken.
I don't think anyone is naive enough to believe that any politician, from any party is going to be able to deliver their manifesto in full, Yogi. I guess it's down to who you trust really. The majority of things I've read say that Labour's figures do stack up - maybe they do, maybe they don't - but at least they have the balls to reveal them.
Theresa May won't debate - she says it's more important to take questions from the voters. Does she ever actually answer any questions? To be honest, I was never Jeremy Corbyn's number one fan, but I've been impressed with him recently and think it's true - we've been fed a lot of horse poo about him by the media and now they have to give him fair air time he's showing what he's made of. He doesn't crumble when he's questioned, she flaps like a wounded a bird and spouts the stock phrases while saying nothing (other than throwing personal insults at the opposition)
I know who I think is the most sincere - and that's before we get down to the policies, from fox hunting and ivory trading, to reducing benefits, to letting the press do whatever the hell they like without fear of retribution... I won't go on. I know who I'd rather have looking after my interests - and it's not a party looking after their own.
As for the Women's Hour thing - I can fully understand that. I can't keep figures in my head (and I manage a ÂĢ7m inventory for a living!) but that doesn't mean I can't put my finger on information if I need to - it's just the way I work. Surely better to say 'let me check' than say the wrong thing (don't start me on Diane Abbot though - that's a lesson she could have learned)
Kaffs posted:I don't think anyone is naive enough to believe that any politician, from any party is going to be able to deliver their manifesto in full, Yogi. I guess it's down to who you trust really. The majority of things I've read say that Labour's figures do stack up - maybe they do, maybe they don't - but at least they have the balls to reveal them.
Theresa May won't debate - she says it's more important to take questions from the voters. Does she ever actually answer any questions? To be honest, I was never Jeremy Corbyn's number one fan, but I've been impressed with him recently and think it's true - we've been fed a lot of horse poo about him by the media and now they have to give him fair air time he's showing what he's made of. He doesn't crumble when he's questioned, she flaps like a wounded a bird and spouts the stock phrases while saying nothing (other than throwing personal insults at the opposition)
I know who I think is the most sincere - and that's before we get down to the policies, from fox hunting and ivory trading, to reducing benefits, to letting the press do whatever the hell they like without fear of retribution... I won't go on. I know who I'd rather have looking after my interests - and it's not a party looking after their own.
As for the Women's Hour thing - I can fully understand that. I can't keep figures in my head (and I manage a ÂĢ7m inventory for a living!) but that doesn't mean I can't put my finger on information if I need to - it's just the way I work. Surely better to say 'let me check' than say the wrong thing (don't start me on Diane Abbot though - that's a lesson she could have learned)
I know you don't but, there are people out there who think Corbyn is going to deliver everything in his Manifesto. If you listen to some, he's so high up there on a pedestal, he's likely to get vertigo!
You say he doesn't crumble but that's exactly what he did on Woman's hour. It may have been quiet flapping but flapping was exactly what it was.
He was on the programme to discuss (amongst other things) his childcare proposals/policy. If he is carp at remembering figures, be prepared and write them down on a small card. He had his iPad with him and couldn't find the figures on that. He could have put the figures into the Notes section of his iPad and had them in a second. Ill prepared and unprofessional.
My late FiL voted Labour all his life and was a union man to his core, and he hated Corbyn and didn't trust him an inch. Nor do I.
May's performance hasn't wowed me either (and they should set the hounds on the chump who thought fox hunting should be back on the table) but I couldn't vote for Corbyn if my life depended on it.
Thank heavens BB starts soon and we'll all have something else to argue over.
Yogi19 posted:
Thank heavens BB starts soon and we'll all have something else to argue over.
Yes, something important! I'll be glad to see the election over, that's for sure. My blood pressure won't cope with much more.
I'm liking Caroline Lucas of the Green Party as well
Sprout posted:I'm liking Caroline Lucas of the Green Party as well
I didn't get home till about half way through, but every one of them had a valid point or two. Every one except Paul Nuttall and Amber Rudd that is.
Kaffs posted:Sprout posted:I'm liking Caroline Lucas of the Green Party as well
I didn't get home till about half way through, but every one of them had a valid point or two. Every one except Paul Nuttall and Amber Rudd that is.
Kaffs posted:Yogi19 posted:
Thank heavens BB starts soon and we'll all have something else to argue over.
You can say that again! It's been a right old shambles from day 1!
A vote for the tories is like a vote for the sun and the Murdoch! He is in cahoots with that party.
For the sweet love of god, see sense wimmin and men folk <3
Vote for us, the people, just not the cons
oh and hello ((hugs))
Diane Abbott: "I will rejoin the fray soon"
PLEASE DON'T
Enthusiastic Contrafibularities posted:
Diane Abbott: "I will rejoin the fray soon"
PLEASE DON'T
I wasn't aware that she had particularly left. Just thought someone had shut her up, for a bit!
ALONE & NAKED
Moonie posted:I thought this was a democracy or has it changed of late?
I will vote for who I have voted for all my voting life. I don't need or want anyone telling me who I should vote for, thank you very much...
nobody is actually telling you who to vote-its just a discussion about the various policies
you stick to your guns, thats what a democracy means
Pirate maybe I misconstrued...
For the sweet love of god, see sense wimmin and men folk <3
Vote for us, the people, just not the cons
Sorry if I did. I can think of lots of things to argue about but politics isn't one of them.
I am gone. Don't really spend much time here for various reasons anymore anyway. Toodles everyone 
Moonie posted:Pirate maybe I misconstrued...
For the sweet love of god, see sense wimmin and men folk <3
Vote for us, the people, just not the cons
Sorry if I did. I can think of lots of things to argue about but politics isn't one of them.
I am gone. Don't really spend much time here for various reasons anymore anyway. Toodles everyone
have a good'un
Extremely Fluffy Fluffy Thing posted:Enthusiastic Contrafibularities posted:
Diane Abbott: "I will rejoin the fray soon"
PLEASE DON'T
I wasn't aware that she had particularly left. Just thought someone had shut her up, for a bit!
Stepping aside due to health issues. If I was being cheeky and based on her recent track record of interviews I would say it's foot and mouth.
Two old biddies being interviewed in St Andrews the other day
"who will you vote for?"
Biddy 1 "Theresa May"
"why?"
Biddy 1 "Because my granny voted Conservative all her life"
"what do you like about Theresa May"
Biddy 2 "Her shoes"
Enthusiastic Contrafibularities posted:Extremely Fluffy Fluffy Thing posted:Enthusiastic Contrafibularities posted:
Diane Abbott: "I will rejoin the fray soon"
PLEASE DON'T
I wasn't aware that she had particularly left. Just thought someone had shut her up, for a bit!
Stepping aside due to health issues. If I was being cheeky and based on her recent track record of interviews I would say it's foot and mouth.
They're probably doing what the Tories would have done with Tessie if they could have got away with it. Instead they just chose to hide her.
Moonie posted:I thought this was a democracy or has it changed of late?
I will vote for who I have voted for all my voting life. I don't need or want anyone telling me who I should vote for, thank you very much...
Spot on Moonie We all see the world differently , but that's our right ....it doesn't make one person wrong or another person right
Moonie posted:Pirate maybe I misconstrued...
For the sweet love of god, see sense wimmin and men folk <3
Vote for us, the people, just not the cons
Sorry if I did. I can think of lots of things to argue about but politics isn't one of them.
I am gone. Don't really spend much time here for various reasons anymore anyway. Toodles everyone
Yes its just a discussion.
with added heart
Lets put it this way Oddschecker has it a ...... TORY WIN
Oh well . . . .
It makes me laugh when Weak and Wobbly goes on about Labour's 'magic money tree', when she won't answer what would be a reasonable settlement between the EU and the UK for the UK's committed obligations. ÂĢ0 and ÂĢ100billion is quite a stark difference. The Labour manifesto is costed, the Tory manifesto is a work of fiction.
No deal with our closest and most profitable traders is a bad deal. May is a waste of space, a consummate vacuous politician who thinks cretinous soundbites like 'strong and stable' are a good enough substitute for actual policy. Ironic since she's proven herself weak and wobbly. She was a shit, incompetent home secretary and she's a shit PM.
Carnelian posted:
No deal with our closest and most profitable traders is a bad deal.
I've been keeping out of this for the most part, but I was talking to friends about the Tories' "No deal is better than a bad deal" line over the weekend, and for me it's been the most ridiculous piece of doublespeak of the whole election campaign.
Normal business thinking in this sort of situation would be exactly the opposite: any deal - good or bad - would be preferable to no deal at all. The one thing that the City, big businesses, etc. hate is uncertainty. Just imagine how they would react if we were to go through 2 years (TWO YEARS!) of negotiations only to end up with nothing to show for it, and the prospect of the uncertainty continuing for goodness-knows how long. The economy would tank completely...
you have to admit, the BBC have ran a stonking Conservative campaign, I'm off to vote for a fairer society
A pearl of wisdom from of all places Big Brother and from knuckle dragger Lotan,
"I don't vote cos eventually they'll all lie and screw you over"
Hope you all USE A PEN !!!
Saint posted:Hope you all USE A PEN !!!
And if the SNP make gains I wan t Nicola Turgid to put a school cap on and say it was "fandabbydozy"
No, not Theresa May ... Jeanette Tough (Little Jimmy Krankie)
I am just leaving work and trying to decide who to vote for. My ward is so strong Labour with a big majority I was thinking of helping the 'Pirate Party' keep their deposit.
...and no, I don't think it has anything to do with Pirate1111.
Baz posted:Saint posted:Hope you all USE A PEN !!!
I did
I just used whatever marking thing provided in the booth.
More importantly, I hope you all voted for ONE candidate only!
I didn't vote
If the SNP do badly tonight I guess they will have to rethink their 2nd indyref idea.
Videostar posted:If the SNP do badly tonight I guess they will have to rethink their 2nd indyref idea.
They'd have to do very badly, though.
It wasn't very well reported, but one of the things Sturgeon said (IIRC during the manifesto launch) was that if the SNP won (i.e. retained) the majority of Scottish seats, they would consider that a mandate for IndyRef2.
Considering how many seats they'd have to lose to drop below the 50% mark, she definitely came across as saying "IndyRef2's happening, no matter what."
Saint posted:And if the SNP make gains I wan t Nicola Turgid to put a school cap on and say it was "fandabbydozy"
Eugene's Lair posted:Videostar posted:If the SNP do badly tonight I guess they will have to rethink their 2nd indyref idea.
They'd have to do very badly, though.
It wasn't very well reported, but one of the things Sturgeon said (IIRC during the manifesto launch) was that if the SNP won (i.e. retained) the majority of Scottish seats, they would consider that a mandate for IndyRef2.
Considering how many seats they'd have to lose to drop below the 50% mark, she definitely came across as saying "IndyRef2's happening, no matter what."
I live in hope, Eugene.
One thing you can be sure of, regardless of the result of this election, Sturgeon will continue to push on with her call for a second Independence Referendum.
velvet donkey posted:Yogi19 posted:Eugene's Lair posted:Videostar posted:If the SNP do badly tonight I guess they will have to rethink their 2nd indyref idea.
They'd have to do very badly, though.
It wasn't very well reported, but one of the things Sturgeon said (IIRC during the manifesto launch) was that if the SNP won (i.e. retained) the majority of Scottish seats, they would consider that a mandate for IndyRef2.
Considering how many seats they'd have to lose to drop below the 50% mark, she definitely came across as saying "IndyRef2's happening, no matter what."
I live in hope, Eugene.
One thing you can be sure of, regardless of the result of this election, Sturgeon will continue to push on with her call for a second Independence Referendum.
Yep. She's desperate for a statue
my 18yr step-son has proudly come in to tell us he's voted..for the 1st time-and he's voted labour
cos he's autistic, he cant do college & has been relying on us to help him out, tories wont help kids like him
he cant do college, cant get any money from government, so he's stuck, now he's 18 he said he wouldnt want other kids like him, but younger, to be broke & he was lucky to have us..some kids arent so lucky
my little naughty b*stard of a step-son has finally grown up!
and, he recently got himself a job, doesnt pay well, but he's earning for himself..the tories overlook kids like him
Do you want a new sticky for discussing the election results?
